Paul Ryan Poll: Do You Feel Differently About the GOP Ticket Now?

Mona Taplin August 14, 2012 at 02:12 pm

The extra costs of medicare under the Ryan plan and the Romney plan have been widely published.Remember, those are two separate plans and Romney has said they will both be working on his plan if he is elected. Both Romney and Ryan are constantly reminding that there will be no big change in those 55 and older (vouchers), but neither is even casually mentioning the additional cost we all will pay for our own medical care. This is part of their Government cut backs in subsidies and entitlements and eventually balancing the budget.

Paisley August 14, 2012 at 02:29 pm

" I just know that I've ready paid a huge chunk into these programs and when guys like Ryan come along its so easy to for them to reach into my pocket and say "YOU have too much."
He isn't saying "you have too much" He's saying let the next generation have "some". And if you guys bankrupt it - none of you will have any. The old people are really being selfish. They are basically saying "I want mine", and I don't care if you have to pay and get nothing. We have all reached a point where people will pay more into SS than they will get out. That seems like a ponzi scheme. Fix it or deal with it.

Mona Taplin August 14, 2012 at 02:29 pm

Robert Livesay, you are 100% correct. Federal, state and Local governments are begining to wake up to the fact that taxpayers don't have a never ending big supply of money to continually pay out percs for former employees from the President on down. The same is true of all other employers in private industry. All of us need to change our way of paying more of our own way,- starting with pensions, lifetime medical care and all other unreasonable percs from the top down.

Karl Wieser August 14, 2012 at 03:04 pm

Lorraine: Thomas Sowell I can see reading, he's an academic with good credentials, and Johah Goldberg and Mark Levin are smart men, if merely pundits who spin for their side of the issues, but David Barton??! Really? A self-styled historian with no meaningful credentials who is dismissed by real historians for his pseudo-scholarship and revisionist writings (certainly not well documented), he's a waste of ink and paper if you're looking for a reliable source of information.

Paisley August 14, 2012 at 04:53 pm

John Chiang, Ca Controller just reported California revenues down 10% YOY, and sales tax down 40% YOY. I thought taxing everyone who made over 250k was suppose to make things all better.
PDF from the Comptrollers office: http://www.sco.ca.gov/Files-EO/08-12summary.pdf

Karl Wieser August 14, 2012 at 05:00 pm

Let's see, do some cherry-picking and data-point confounding in the data set to distort the ratios, then make invalid leaps in logic to extend some half-assed assumptions about political donations to a wider realm of donations, and don't forget to twist your oppositions point of view into some "evil rich people" strawman .. yeah, these are republican "facts"

Jon Spangler August 14, 2012 at 05:26 pm

Moribund Dave,
May I offer a correction? The economic inequality is actually worse than at any time in US history since 1928-1929--just before the 1929 Wall Street crash that began the darkest parts of the Great Depression. And we now have Romney and Ryan, whose federal budget plans would take us back to the dark and inequitable days of Calvin Coolidge. As to the poll question, I never favored Romney or anyone else on the obstructionist, anti-governance Republican side for president. All the Republicans have done--and bragged about in public--since 2009 has been to derail constructive and common-sense proposals in order to be able to turn around and claim (falsely) that president Obama has "failed." Those proposals, from health care reform, taxation, economic recovery, and rebuilding our infrastructure to shifting our economy to to a greener and more sustainable basis, have often been proposals that Republicans first came up with or historically supported but now disavow--simply because they want to pursue personal and partisan electoral goals instead of responsibly governing our nation. Such treasonous irresponsibility should not be tolerated, much less rewarded.

Jon Spangler August 14, 2012 at 05:38 pm

The Republicans, who have persisted in spreading big lies about president Obama (the birth certificate lie and the "he's a Muslim" lie, for starters), are the ones going negative. And the Republicans, who swore an oath to uphold the US Constitution, have violated that oath in order to oppose and defeat President Obama at any cost, including Rep. Ryan's personal torpedoing of two bipartisan deficit-reduction proposals.
How do you square your support of the anti-Christian Ryan budget plan (RC bishops and other church leaders have told Ryan, a supposedly "good Cathoilic," that) and the Republicans' failure to help govern our state or our nation, with your support of the Romney-Ryan ticket? Doing so would seem to me to be highly unpatriotic and unChristian.

Paul French August 14, 2012 at 05:46 pm

Wow, a lot of uninformed opinions here. Sad that so many people from Alameda are so opinionated and yet don't really understand the debate. As many have noted, the Romney/Ryan plan greatly benefits the wealthy at the expense of the poor and middle class. If you are middle class it doesn't make much economic sense to vote Republican, yet people have been tricked into doing so based on social issues, propaganda, or an unrealistic dream that one day they too will be in the 1%.
Fortunately, CA will go for Obama, so all the right wingers here won't get their way.

Jon Spangler August 14, 2012 at 05:50 pm

Dear KFrances, So do you oppose having people who insist on moving into high-fire-risk rural areas paying a fairer share of the actual costs of preventing and fighting fires when they occur? I see nothing wrong whatsoever with people actually taking responsibility for their choices and paying a reasonable fee ($150/year is cheap compared to paying an insurance policy deductible) to prevent and fight wildland fires when those people, by moving to rural areas and raising the fire risk, are are increasing the costs of rural fire prevention and firefighting.

Jon Spangler August 14, 2012 at 05:57 pm

robert Livesay,
Don't forget that the sources you condemn as 'very Liberal (sic)" are also among the most accurate sources available, according to objective measurements by schools of journalism and professional journalism organizations. (Listeners of National Public Radio are judged the best-informed consumers of news when the accuracy of their information is measured against those who listen to or watch other news sources like Fox News.)

Jon Spangler August 14, 2012 at 05:58 pm

KF--Not if you listen to public radio....

Jon Spangler August 14, 2012 at 06:05 pm

KFeances,
Having paid lots of premiums to Anthem/Blue Cross, who "rationed" my care and has made my life awful more than once, I'd MUCH rather have an accountable government agency making those decisions. Government overhead (Medicare, MediCal, etc.) costs much less in overhead to deliver services than the private sector, where 20-30% of the premiums I paid went to profit (and corporate executives' salaries and bonuses), I do NOT want greedy corporate profiteers choking off my health care choices any more, thank you very much. Profit margins for health insurance companies do NOTHING to improve health care delivery.

Paisley August 14, 2012 at 06:06 pm

"I see nothing wrong whatsoever with people actually taking responsibility for their choices and paying a reasonable fee ($150/year is cheap compared to paying an insurance policy deductible) "
I agree with the first part, but are you suggesting they can stop paying their insurance policies because of this new tax? Or even stop paying the portion on their property tax bill they already pay for fire services? Even if people were proactive about preparing their properties, would they be exempt? Of course not.

Jack Manes August 14, 2012 at 06:15 pm

The young workers today that are lucky enough to have a job mostly are living pay check to pay check. Toss in Ryans plan on Medicare and Social Security, how are these young famiies supposed to pay for that let alone have any safety net?

Albert Rubio August 14, 2012 at 06:16 pm

Jon Spangler,
>The economic inequality is actually worse than at any time in US history what is the importance of 'economic inequality' if it is arrived at by voluntary exchanges? In addition, I would argue that it is no indicator of value when Americans, especially in the bottom and middle rungs, have enjoyed a rising standard of living and life expectancy unprecedented in world history in-spite of such 'inequality'. 'Economic inequality' seems to be important to the Socialist philosophy. Do you advocate some form of wealth redistribution? This being said, I oppose what is called 'corporatism' and favor a free and voluntary market without government intervention or redistribution of wealth..

Paisley August 14, 2012 at 06:23 pm

That isn't an argument in your favor. When the country "occasionally" creates 6000 jobs - people live paycheck to paycheck. Hell, the hiring at that mall would be 1/3'rd of what the whole country is adding.
(corrected to say 1/3)

Mona Taplin August 14, 2012 at 06:32 pm

Paisley I'm a depression born old person, and neither I or any of my friends want younger generations to pay and get nothing in return. It's no secret that most people pay more into Soc Sec than they get out of it, but we also remember what an unpleasant life many thousands of America's elderly endured before Social Security. We don't want the coming generations to go back to that. We old people are the ones who are most likely to go to the polls to vote, and we are the ones who take a look at past, present, and look to the future of you younger peope. We've lived thru good times and bad, not just read sometimes highly exaggerated reports about the "good old days." What we want for you is a more secure world financially and free from worry about being invaded. We want you to have immediate access to the finest medical care if the need should arise. We know far better than any of you younger people how valuable a top quality education is for every American. We want "outsourcing" to end, so there will be a plentiful supply of jobs for all of you. That's being selfish????Or is it possible that the younger generations have had it so much easier that they don't know how to cope when hard times come?

Mona Taplin August 14, 2012 at 06:38 pm

And I hope the rest of the country will see the flaws in Romney/Ryan and vote OBAMA/BIDEN

c5 August 14, 2012 at 07:09 pm

speaking of uninformed opinions...
you are right about how california will vote, but clearly you haven't done your homework on the impacts on what romney is proposing in terms of reforms to the tax code INCLUDING the reductions to deductions that are being talked about that would fall almost exclusively on the wealthy. this could mean the end of the interest deduction for munis and on life insurance savings among other tax benefits that the wealthy enjoy.. and if the muni deduction goes away (as it probably should if marginal rates are lowered) it would be bad for profligate spending/borrowing states like california that like to borrow money continuously to pay for public sector benefits...which as greece can tell you is a disastrous combination.

Voter with an ID August 14, 2012 at 07:09 pm

Gotta love reading all the gloom and doom predictions from the east bay leftists cabal. Nothing like a little wild exaggeration to distract people from 3 years of total failure and economic demise.
Yeah, sure, let's all sign up for more of the same since it's going so well. And on the local front, let's continue to keep dems in the legislature because California has been goin in the right direction for over 40 years now. You leftists must be so proud of your accomplishments.

Bud Burlison August 14, 2012 at 07:14 pm

Repugnants try to bury the middle class and the Dems have to dig them out. Takes time to move all that manure.

c5 August 14, 2012 at 07:19 pm

if we don't reform medicare and medicaid (and social security for that matter) how are our kids going to pay for the tens of trillions in unfunded liabilities that are already baked into the current system? where is the money going to come from? i would argue that it is hopelessly naive to click your heels together and hope and pray that these programs stay the way they are, because if you look at the math, it is not possible for that to be the outcome.
right now the only way for our kids to have a safety net that can catch anything is to reform these insolvent programs. to think they are ok is dangerous and ignorant of the economic realities imo.

c5 August 14, 2012 at 07:21 pm

not in california, they are still of the mind that they can pay for anything with facebook capital gains....

c5 August 14, 2012 at 07:25 pm

they are making things better, only they are increasingly doing it in other states, not california. if the disastrous tax measure on the ballot passes it could just be the last nail in the coffin for this state. like it or not california has to compete with other states and countries for businesses and successful individuals. there are plenty of locations that encourage, rather than vilify, success...

Jack Manes August 14, 2012 at 07:46 pm

@c5
How about getting out of these 2 wars, cut the waste in defense spending currently 20% of GDP, end farm subsidies to farm corporations, reform taxes so its equatible fof all, surley a few thousand extra from the multi millionaires and billionaires wont hurt them. Its the Repubs that grew the deficet, remember the surplus at the end of the Clinton era? Dubya got rid of that in a hurry and spent like crazy into the trillions. Reform banks, wall street, pharmacuticals. With the scrapping of regulations the crooks took over and put us in the mess were in now. Then we can give our kids a fighting chance.

CJ August 14, 2012 at 07:58 pm

Spngler- You're trust of the MSM(NPR is MSM) is hilarious.

KFrances August 14, 2012 at 08:38 pm

Maybe California and the Country will wake up once they realize the government wants to herd them in to high rises and close off large portions of land to humans (Liberal Earth Charter garbage) Maybe the rest of the country will wake up too and let people and businesses work and thrive in California and this country instead of taxing them for fake Climate Change Cap n' Trade garbage. The government geoengineers the weather and geoengineers food. I hope people wake up to what is really going on.

Tim August 14, 2012 at 08:54 pm

What gains? Their stock is worth half of that it was on IPO.

Regular Guy August 14, 2012 at 09:35 pm

As c5 says, just keeping benefit programs the way they are is not an option. A candidate may tell you that all those promised benefits can be maintained with only minor tweaks, but that's a complete lie. The government has done a Bernie Madoff and your past tax money is gone forever.
You may feel entitled to benefits but Congress is not required to pay them to you. Once the government goes bankrupt, only the needy will receive benefits. It's never too early for the government to retract impossible promises. Ryan knows the math and he says those promises are impossible to keep. Vote for a candidate who denies this at your own risk.